Truth about godhra train accident

[Against Desiguy]

I am SURE this DESIGUY does not know what\'s happenning in India and surrounding countries.What happenned to Hindus in Afganistan,How is afganisthan now a muslim country,What happenned to Hindus in Bangladesh.Now hindus have been ethincally cleaned in Bangladesh from 40% to 20% by killing and driving them to india in the name of religion.How come paksitan has selectively driven away Hindus from Pak into India (once again ethinc cleaning).How come where there is 20% or more muslim population there is anti india activities and communal voilence.Seems Desiguy is afraid of the facts in india.He does not know that 2 crores of Bangla Muslims have illegally entered into ASsam,Bengal and BIhar.They have been given ration cards and citizen ships for the muslim votes.

[Concerned Indian Muslim]

I am a practicing Muslim. I believe the essence of Islam is not different from the essence of all godly religions - the betterment of human society. True Islam demands equal protection to all from any kind of individual or collective tyranny, and no compulsion in the matter of belief/faith.

A dialogue to understand each other\'s point of view and working out a solution to address the difficulties faced by both sides is important to solve the problem of Babri Masjid/Ram Temple.

I want to comment on Mr. Nagaraja Sarma\'s remarks of March 7th. He has raised interesting points. I will quote his words and then bring the other perspective.

1..\" The fact of the matter is, that muslims living in India for centuries, by now should know what their origins are, where from they came\"

This kind of statement sends a message that ALL Muslims are foreigners! While many Muslims came from other lands, bulk of them are indigenous coverts. No matter what, the last several generations of all Muslims had made India as their home. The ruling and priestly class of Hindus also came from other lands and settled in India. By that logic, vast number of Hindus settled in USA, Britain, Europe, Australia, Africa, S. America, Caribbean and just about any country in the world should be considered foreigners and never taken as legitimate citizens with equal rights. Is that a valid argument for civilized people?

2. \"The Babri Masjid was built demolishing a temple which was erected on a site supposed to have been the place where the birth of Lord Rama took place. …. Why not the Muslims realise that the birth places of Rama and Krishna are as unique as Mecca and Madina to Muslims and therefore allow the Hindus to have their temples rebuilt at these unique sites ?\". … This can atmost happen at the few sites where originally temples were there and which were demolished and masjids built by the Muslim attackers in the past centuries. \"

It is a valid question. Muslims are Islamically duty-bound to demolish the mosque and for that matter any mosque that was built by demolishing a temple or any place of worship. In fact the prayers in a mosque built in this way will not be acceptable to the God of one and all of us that includes Muslims and Hindus alike. If it can be established by unbiased investigation that the Babri Masjid was built replacing a temple, even if it is not the birth place of lord Rama, Muslims should, and I am sure they will accept relocating the mosque. That is why they are looking forward to an honest investigation. Who else can the country trust more than our highest institution for justice, the \"Supreme Court \"? What you are asking Mr. Sarma is that the Muslims should be magnanimous to allow the replacement of the Mosque, just out of goodwill. If Muslims follow your line of approach then it causes several problems. a) What is the justification for that? Simply that some people think it was \"supposed to be\" and not \"established by fact finding to be\" Lord Rama\'s birth place? b) Would it not open the door for demolishing and replacing just about any mosque that is chosen by some people on similar pretext. This logic could then be extended to other religious minorities and open door for demolishing churches, Gurudwaras, Budhdhist temples, Mahaveer temples, etc. This has long term serious implications on the well being of India as a civilized nation. c) It causes a theological problem for Muslims. Muslims have to have a just basis to relocate a mosque. Do you think a Hindu sincerely practicing his faith will feel comfortable praying in a Mandir built after demolishing a place of worship without ascertaining the pretext by honest investigation ?

.3. \" Well you might say that for having not been able to face the Muslim conquerers then, now the Hindus should keep quiet and allow the statusquo to continue. Well, then the might ruled and not justice, so why are you now looking for justice from the supreme court instead of facing the might of majority Hindus?\"

I hope you are not saying that the old rule of uncivilized world \"Might is Right\" should be our governing principle! If we agree to that, then we cannot condemn any unjust cause, as long as it is supported by might. Can you imagine what would be like, if strong nations start ruling over weak nations. Think of India under British rule? Not only that, it will not bring civility and peace to any one, because history proves that one who is powerful, is bound to become weak some time in the future. What the civilized world can contribute is to bring justice to all, particularly to the weakest of the weak. If we succumb to the \"Rule of Jungle\" than overwhelming majority of innocent, decent people of all religions and cultures will pay a heavy price.

There are sincere followers in all religions and there are people who exploit the faith for totally unholy purposes. It is quite possible that some misguided Muslims in the past generations may have done wrong. The wrong must be established by appropriate fact finding before it can be remedied.

If the past Muslim conquerors did injustice, they acted against their faith and should be condemned. Hindus and Muslims alike should not allow any unjust status quo to continue. To correct injustice one cannot resort to another injustice. As civilized people, and in the long term interest of the country we must always resort to justice even if it goes against our own interest.

[desiguy02]

Indian think rationally before you write/talk. Everything is wrong with one women having five husbands. If she bears a child, how will you know who has fathered that child??!!! Who will take responsibility for fathering that child? Now don\'t tell me -- all!!!

[desiguy]

Muslims have coexisted with other religions throughout history. They protected/sheltered jews and their holy sites from the Roman atrocities, they protected christians and their churches. The prove is that the muslims are the caretakers of holy shrines in jerusalem even till this day. They co-existed peacefully with Hindus during their 800 years of muslim rule. The proof is that Hindus are still in majority in this country despite the 800 years of muslim rule. Had muslims been barbarians/crusaders they would have wiped out all Hindus from the face of this earth.

[desiguy]

In fact Hindus are less tolerable, even to their own religion! Look at the loss of life that was caused during the Ashoka\'s rule. Also what happened to the buddhists of India? After ashoka became a budhist most of the India was budhist? Then where did they all go? Dont you think that was ethnic cleansing from Hindus part?

[prince]

you are right desiguy, if muslims were barbarians they would have cleaned india from hindus and made it a pure muslim country as they ruled india more than 800 years. we find hindus in majority in india because muslim were secular.

[against coward dupe indian]

THIS IS BULL SHIT.DUPE IN THE NAME OF INDIAN.INSPITE MUSLIMS\' BARBARIC RULE HINDUS HAVE SURVIVED.MUSLIM RULES IN INDIA TRIED HARD WITH CRUEL MEANS TO CONVERT HINDUS.ONE EXAMPLE IS GURU TEG BAHADUR.MUSLIMS IN INDIA ARE HINDUS CONVERTED BY THESE FORIEGN MUSLIM INVADORS.DO NOT TRY TO JUST BULL SHIT WITH HISTORY.