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Kill Bill. Bludgeon, roast and torch him also.

by Jabbala Rayudu » Fri May 14, 2004 9:44 pm

Saw this highly recommended movie the other day - Kill Bill. The only thing funnier than it was Kill Bill 2! Hyuk, hyuk! I could not believe that most of my friends were actually raving about this movie.



I heard that there are a lot of Kill Bill lovers out here. So I just wanted to know what it was that you people liked about the movie. This is not an invitation for a flame or something. I saw the movie, and I did not see any reason why people should actually like the movie. So just wanted to broaden my horizons...
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by gods_gift2_mankind » Fri May 14, 2004 9:47 pm

Buddy 2 words for u - Pure Art!!



That's what Kill Bill was. Am in a rush now. Will post more on this later... This is not over! :evil:
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by agonys_requiem » Fri May 14, 2004 9:56 pm

Pure art you say gg2m????? This is funnier than picturing you in a lungi.... Kill Bill was an insult to Tarantino's earlier masterpieces.... both the parts sucked to high heaven......

One of the many glitches in the movie..... since i know a lot of people are gonna be dissed and will be posting soon enough.....

For you all people who go around advertising the supremacy and efficiency of google and the Kill Bill fans...... do a search of the Yakuza... and you will find much to your chargin that there is NO single head of all the families, as is portrayed in the movie by the character of Lucy Lui....

Many more such glitches but then given the fact that both the parts were such hoots... who gives an eff........
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by Cowboy » Fri May 14, 2004 10:12 pm

gods_gift2_mankind wrote:Buddy 2 words for u - Pure Art!!




2 words - It succckkkkkkkkkkkkkks!!!

It is beyond doubt the crappiest movie I ever saw. After Kill Bill and KB 2, I'm not even sure whether to watch this Qura-something guy's other movies. Heck, it just cracks me up when my friends compare this fella with Martin Scorsese. Guess what, I'm confident of my abilities as a director now, as I saw Kill Bill being appreciated.
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by LP_Fan » Fri May 14, 2004 10:22 pm

Cowboy wrote:
gods_gift2_mankind wrote:Buddy 2 words for u - Pure Art!!


2 words - It succckkkkkkkkkkkkkks!!!
It is beyond doubt the crappiest movie I ever saw. After Kill Bill and KB 2, I'm not even sure whether to watch this Qura-something guy's other movies. Heck, it just cracks me up when my friends compare this fella with Martin Scorsese. Guess what, I'm confident of my abilities as a director now, as I saw Kill Bill being appreciated.




Scorsese(sp?) and Tarantino,you cant compare both of them.Both of them deal w/ complelety different styles of directing.Tarantino's directing is unique(No-Linear Scenes,etc) and even Scorsese's direction is unique.They shoot completely different genre's.



Anyway I am waiting for Inglorious Bastards(Hope the mods leave this on coz its a name of a film :D ).Its gonna release in 2005.
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by Jaszalcatraz » Sat May 15, 2004 12:53 am

After many drafts of this post, some of which defended the movie, some of which were sure to piss you off, I came up with the following:-



To each his own.



QT is God for most hardcore movie buffs.



Kill Bill rocks.
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by LP_Fan » Sat May 15, 2004 1:06 am

Jaszalcatraz wrote:After many drafts of this post, some of which defended the movie, some of which were sure to piss you off, I came up with the following:-

To each his own.

QT is God for most hardcore movie buffs.

Kill Bill rocks.




Yeah,everyone has their own opinon and QT is GOD along w/ Cameron and Spielberg. :)
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by Jaszalcatraz » Sat May 15, 2004 1:20 am

**blah**
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by Habitual Perfectionist » Sat May 15, 2004 4:38 am

AR....talking of glitches...tell me one single movie which didn't have glitches.



I watch movies because I want to get entertained. Who cares whether there is a single yakuza in Japland or not. Kill Bill (haven't yet seen volume 2 as I dont want to dilute the pleasure by watching it on small screen) was a better entertainer than most of the films i've ever seen.



Let's match wits here. For evey glitch you point out, I'll point out one piece of finesse. And better still for you, this will be a handicap match. You can point out glitches from both Vol 1 & 2 whereas I won't even touch Vol 2.



In reply to your first glitch about the hierarchy of the Jap underworld, here's my piece of finesse. The style of narration in the movie. Was any other movie narrated better save The Godfather?
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by akhilis2cool » Sat May 15, 2004 10:16 am

HP bhai I think that guy is not coming back to the DB. must have been a Hardcore telugu movie fan used to watching the same old stuff in each and every movie.
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by gods_gift2_mankind » Sat May 15, 2004 10:21 am

KB is not something that u can sit down and explain - u either get it or u don't

the problem here is that everybody here has an opinion and will voice it. :)
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by Jabbala Rayudu » Sat May 15, 2004 10:39 am

HP, if the logic behind defending a movie is that no other movie is glitchless, then any movie can be defended. The worst of them can be easily defended saying no other movie is error free.



It is the extent to which the errors mark the movie that matters.



And I personally don't think the style of narration that is being talked about is original. I can't supplement it with specific examples, but throughout the movie we can clearly see the influence of spaghetti westerns, asian kung-fu classics and the retro style of the 70's.



Copying things cannot be called as being stylish I feel.
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by Cowboy » Sat May 15, 2004 10:53 am

gods_gift2_mankind wrote:KB is not something that u can sit down and explain - u either get it or u don't
the problem here is that everybody here has an opinion and will voice it. :)




See, that's the whole problem. I watch a movie for entertainment - pure entertainment. I just don't want to overclock my brain trying to figure out what the hell's going on. Why can't that guy make a nice, simple and easy to understand movies? :roll:

Well, talking about voicing opinions, Kill Bill sucks...a good example of a bad movie - even those are rare these days :D
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by ar » Sat May 15, 2004 11:26 am

What Qt has done with this movie is give it a lot of anime, sometimes fascinating camera angles and lots of blood (har har har) to cover up the simple fact that this movie is as empty on substance as a gay bar when Karan Johar is in town. The only reason the other QT movies were so good was simply because the characters were believable. The character of the “bride” made me wanna stick my fingers into my eyes.



Simple point here hp, there were four of them, lui who goes onto be the head of the Yakuza (god please take me away), Fox (an assassin), Madison (another assassin), Hannah (hot assassin) and Mr. Bill. And they all belong to a very elite squad of assassins. How come with all their killing expertise, their bullets, their other forms of tough love, they couldn’t take down a pregnant woman, who from all appearances didn’t put up a fight. This little screwup is responsible for the even bigger screw up which happens to be the movie itself. Finesse you say brother???? There is no “finesse” in the style of narration since its been the bread and butter of Japanese movies for a long time. So there was nothing original there either.



As for the blood and gore, it just made me roll on the floor with laughter. Neo and Agent smith fighting in the Manhattan skyline was far more believable. And the whole scene with the kid in the kitchen when uma dices the kid’s mother was just an attempt at being shocking for the sake of being shocking. It really served no cosmic purpose…. sure you might argue that this was in context to what was done to the bride.... but then if you dissect this point enough you'll see that there is no connection whatsoever... the bride was pregnant.... the kid was already their.... that's like abortion versus adoption....





And as for the handicap’s…. bad decision brother…. This movie has like the telugu dude said, as much finesse as any of the other crappy movies that you see for exactly the same angle of reasoning……

And me thinks you’re on crack for actually comparing the Godfather (sigh) to KB…… one of the main reasons as to why the Godfather was soooo good, is because the characters had a realism about them which is completely absent in a film like KB….
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by Cowboy » Sat May 15, 2004 2:15 pm

ar wrote:And me thinks you’re on crack for actually comparing the Godfather (sigh) to KB…… one of the main reasons as to why the Godfather was soooo good, is because the characters had a realism about them which is completely absent in a film like KB….




Godfather was inspired by a real life Don. I remember reading about his death a couple of years ago. Can anyone be so caring and the same time so terrifying, is beyond the limits of my imagination. Facts or fiction, Godfather is beyond doubt the best movie ever made( no, Citizen Kane and Casablanca sucked - saw them recently). The portrayal of Don's role is simply amazing and it could be true. I finished reading "The Sicilian" a couple of months back, and the Don's little speech at the end is damn good. KB is nothing like the godfather. One more comparision and Coppola will kill himself.
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by Jaszalcatraz » Sat May 15, 2004 3:25 pm

Enough goofing off in this room, now I'll try to get serious and defend my favourite director and his fabulous Kill Bill movies.

QT (as fans call him) is so loved because of his geeky movie fanboy image which every movie fan on the globe would like to have. His intricate knowledge of even the most obscure of movies (let alone genres like B-grade Japanese grindhouse flicks and Spaghetti westerns) is something I, and every movie fan, can only dream of having.

His rants about little details, that we rarely notice, reassures my belief that movies are perhaps the greatest form of art. His movies are so filled with little homages to so many movies that we would like to go back and watch those flicks just to be able to make th connection and enjoy the geeky joke.

His greatest ability is what most people call the Tarantinoesque dialogue. Characters involve themselves in pointless banter about foot massages, Madonna videos or Comic Book Heroes. This kind of dialogue is a rage among directors today. It's called "new talk". Some of the most tightasss directors are putting new-talk in their flicks, including Hindi movies and telugu movies.

But what these copycats do not realize is that every bit of this seemingly pointless QTspeak has great significance in the flick or, in some cases, "echoes great literature in a modern, profane form: The opening exchange between Jules and Vincent about what the French call Quarter-Pounders, for example, is a reminder of the conversation between Jim and Huckleberry Finn about why the French don't speak English. Jules is constantly quoting what he identifies as Ezekiel 25:17 from the Bible, and although some of the words are the same, he has embroidered a lot."

Above quote from Rogert Ebert, Kluge Film Fellow, University of Virginia.

Also his banter in most cases furthers the movie. If not for the foot-massage banter, there would be no date with Mia Wallace. If not for Christopher Walken and the gold watch story, Vincent Vega would have been alive. Another Tarantino aspect that has audiences hooked is that every story ends with a form of redemption. Whether it be killing Oren or Jules quitting the crime scene.



Jabbala Rayudu wrote:And I personally don't think the style of narration that is being talked about is original. I can't supplement it with specific examples, but throughout the movie we can clearly see the influence of spaghetti westerns, asian kung-fu classics and the retro style of the 70's.

Copying things cannot be called as being stylish I feel.


As far as similiar scenes from other movies showing up in Tarantino's work, someone once said that there is nothing new under the sun. This is especially true in movie making. There have been possibly hundreds of thousands of various films made since movies were invented, so its obvious that when trying to make a movie, whatever idea you would like to put in this movie will have been done somewhere before.

Virtually every movie is based in part on some previous film. For example, "Under Seige" was "Die Hard" on a battle ship, etc., etc, etc. If you want to get really technical, the first director to film a scene where one of his characters gets shot in the head is the inventor of that idea, and anyone else who films a character getting shot in the head is ripping him off. Would any rational person say this? Probably not.
What's important is not that the ideas are recycled from other places, but that any paticular director puts these recycled ideas into the context of HIS creation, then they become part of his movie, and belong to both the new production and the original source.

ar wrote:Simple point here hp, there were four of them, lui who goes onto be the head of the Yakuza (god please take me away), Fox (an assassin), Madison (another assassin), Hannah (hot assassin) and Mr. Bill. And they all belong to a very elite squad of assassins. How come with all their killing expertise, their bullets, their other forms of tough love, they couldn’t take down a pregnant woman, who from all appearances didn’t put up a fight.


Lets just call it a moment of movie magic. If movies today can show one man stopping trains with the power of his moustache, or the President of the US blasting aliens, or Trinity learning to fly a chopper in 3 seconds. It's just a time when you have to suspend imagination for the sake of a story unfolding.

ar wrote:As for the blood and gore, it just made me roll on the floor with laughter. Neo and Agent smith fighting in the Manhattan skyline was far more believable


That WAS the whole point of the extreme violence. It's something to be laughed at. This takes me to another genre where similar methods are used to extract laughter. (PSD territory here) ZOMBIES. It aint mainstream as Romance or Slasher flicks, it's a complete cult (kvlt) genre made only for those truly in love with movies. You are SUPPOSSED to laugh at the blood and gore. Similar reactions were what the Tokyo industry was looking for when they used blood-filled condoms to explode on impact.

Cowboy wrote:and Coppola will kill himself.


I love his movies too, but after a movie like Jack, I think he shuld.



And to all the comparisons made here, I have just one thing to say "have fun, you arent going to get anywhere with these comparisons. It's like comparing Football and Cricket. Just because they're played in a field doesnt mean you compare them. The genres in question are different, the eras are different. Just because they're on screen doesnt mean you compare them."
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by Jabbala Rayudu » Sat May 15, 2004 4:12 pm

What's important is not that the ideas are recycled from other places, but that any paticular director puts these recycled ideas into the context of HIS creation, then they become part of his movie, and belong to both the new production and the original source.




This means that if tom. someone makes everything exactly like Kill Bill, but changes the name, then one must fall in love with that, too, eh? You tell me, would the same rational gentleman (who would not agree that shooting a guy in every movie is the same) think that this movie is also a brilliant piece of art? If he does, then, the definition of 'rational' must seriously be looked into.



Oh, I did not know that all the gore was actually meant to make you laff. I thought... ok... one point cleared here. I did laugh, alright.
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by Cowboy » Sat May 15, 2004 5:01 pm

Jaszalcatraz's got way too much free time. Jas bhai, me still waiting for YOUR list of movies ;)
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by Jaszalcatraz » Sat May 15, 2004 7:24 pm

Jabbala Rayudu wrote:
What's important is not that the ideas are recycled from other places, but that any paticular director puts these recycled ideas into the context of HIS creation, then they become part of his movie, and belong to both the new production and the original source.


This means that if tom. someone makes everything exactly like Kill Bill, but changes the name, then one must fall in love with that, too, eh?




I feel the flames being fanned.
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by LP_Fan » Sun May 16, 2004 12:04 am

Good defence Jasz :D
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by LP_Fan » Sun May 16, 2004 2:28 am

I am a QT fan because of this:



"Sure, Kill Bill's a violent movie. But it's a Tarantino movie. You don't go to see Metallica and ask the f***ers to turn the music down" - on media criticisms of violence in his movies-------QT



:D :D
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by EroXenoS » Sun May 16, 2004 1:33 pm

To the guy who started this thread, and to the others who are dissing QT:



1) Do you actually know what anime is?



2) Do you know the difference between something called a "homage" and a "copy"?



3) Other than having seen Indian movies and Coppola and Spielberg and lots of your college-dom movies like Memento and Mulholland Drive and whatever-it-is-so-and-so-director-made-and-you-think-is-cool, do you have any concept of what genre cinema is?



3) How many times did you see Kuch Kuch Hota Hai ? Oh, ok, how many films do you see every month?



Yeah, ok, so right now, you are framing your reply to this post, thinking up things like, "This is a Fullhyd thread, and not a quiz test, freak." Don't bother. Be happy with whatever "classic" movies you've seen, the list you've culled painstakingly from imdb or filmsite and try to tell others that you are a film critic of astounding proportions. Remember, I am not asking you to defend any movies you like, I am just telling you to take your pathological misunderstanding of Kill Bill and be very gleeful about it. It would also be nice if you could at least let your ignorance not show through when you're discussing movies.



To the guys who are defending Kill Bill in front of our hallowed Movie Critics, it's not worth it, fellas. Save your breath and typewriting, and do what irks flamers the most - ignore them. Let them and their precious brethren improve their skills of movie crtique on their own.
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by Jaszalcatraz » Sun May 16, 2004 2:15 pm

EroXenoS wrote:To the guys who are defending Kill Bill in front of our hallowed Movie Critics, it's not worth it, fellas. Save your breath and typewriting, and do what irks flamers the most - ignore them. Let them and their precious brethren improve their skills of movie crtique on their own.




Dang!

Was waiting for popesmokesdope and Azazel to reply to that post. Their gallis would have been more crude but equally hilarious.

Glad to see yuo again.
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by Jabbala Rayudu » Sun May 16, 2004 2:17 pm

To the guy who started this thread, and to the others who are dissing QT:

1) Do you actually know what anime is?

2) Do you know the difference between something called a "homage" and a "copy"?

3) Other than having seen Indian movies and Coppola and Spielberg and lots of your college-dom movies like Memento and Mulholland Drive and whatever-it-is-so-and-so-director-made-and-you-think-is-cool, do you have any concept of what genre cinema is?

3) How many times did you see Kuch Kuch Hota Hai ? Oh, ok, how many films do you see every month?

Yeah, ok, so right now, you are framing your reply to this post, thinking up things like, "This is a Fullhyd thread, and not a quiz test, freak." Don't bother. Be happy with whatever "classic" movies you've seen, the list you've culled painstakingly from imdb or filmsite and try to tell others that you are a film critic of astounding proportions. Remember, I am not asking you to defend any movies you like, I am just telling you to take your pathological misunderstanding of Kill Bill and be very gleeful about it. It would also be nice if you could at least let your ignorance not show through when you're discussing movies.

To the guys who are defending Kill Bill in front of our hallowed Movie Critics, it's not worth it, fellas. Save your breath and typewriting, and do what irks flamers the most - ignore them. Let them and their precious brethren improve their skills of movie crtique on their own.




It's a pity that in so many utterly frustrated and vanquished words, there was no room for a single competent sentence trying to explain just why the movie was good...
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by ar » Sun May 16, 2004 2:23 pm

Ah… I love it when people respond to criticism with redundant questions. The assumptions on the other hand were hilarious… Spielberg, Coppola…. Har har har…. As for the thing about anime and homage…. Brother I don’t think you opened your loins and out popped anime… its there for every and anybody who wants to see it. The homage and copying part… there is a very fine line between the two… QT never mentioned “homage” when he nitpicked all the styles… the critic’s (look up this word in a dictionary and you’ll be surprised) did.

I believe there is a bug in your hiney…. Next time round come up with something that actually addresses the argument…
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